E220 Sluggish

1986-1995 : 200TD, 200CE, E200, 260E, 300E 2.6, 300E 2.8, 300E, E320, 400E, E420, 500E, E500, 300CE, E320, 230TE, 300TE, 300D 2.5 TURBO, E300 DIESEL, 300TD, 300E 4MATIC, 300TE 4MATIC, E36 AMG
Post Reply
User avatar
RavzSa
S Class
Posts: 85
Joined: Tue 05 Mar, 2019 4:32 am
Model you own: w124
Region: Other (please specify below)
Location: South Africa

E220 Sluggish

Post by RavzSa »

Hi all,

My 220E / E220 M111 has become sluggish over the years especially on take-off and when going up-hill but once on the freeway and up to about 120km it will easily cruise up to 160km.. Whilst I understand its the little 2.2 I remember it being quite nippy.

There's actually no change in acceleration when the accelerator pedal is about halfway until the floor. The car almost never shifts down and in most instances, I have to press the kick down to get it to shift down. But even when the kick-down is engaged the acceleration does not feel correct.

One thing to note is that it does hold its speed going up-hill but almost impossible to over-take without hitting the kick down.

I've checked the throttle cable and confirmed that the butterfly valve is being correctly activated.

I've done the following so far with little to no change to the acceleration;
1. replaced the fuel pumps (Bosch)
2. replaced the fuel filter (MB)
3. replaced fuel pressure regulator (Chinese)
4. rebuilt and cleaned the throttle actuator
5. changed transmission oil (Dextron 2)
6. changed transmission filter (MB)
7. adjusted Bowden cable.
8. Compression test on all 4 cylinders was consistent and around 13psi

The only fault code on the ECU is a faulty crankshaft sensor but assume this cant impact the acceleration..?

Besides pulling the transmission out, is there anything else to look at?
1993 | W124 | 220E / E220 | WDB1240226B970861 | 230 000km
User avatar
Bartman4800
SLS AMG
Posts: 2786
Joined: Fri 10 Oct, 2008 12:10 am
Model you own: w111
Location: Perth WA

Re: E220 Sluggish

Post by Bartman4800 »

I suspect the faulty crankshaft sensor will make the engine go into limp mode.

It's an important sensor on the engine and I would suggest to replace it asap.

Regards, Bart
1963 220 Sb Sedan "Kermit" (Australian Assembly)
1960 220 Sb Sedan "Zum Schlachten" (Early German Assembly, with a torsion bar spring for the bonnet) - Stored in Country WA
2012 W212 E250CDI
1981 Subaru Brumby 1.8 with Weber and 5-speed box "little utie" - Sold to another enthusiast!
2006 Ford Focus "daily driver"
2002 VW Passat V6 30V Station Wagon (SOLD - This car into a money pit)
2011 Kia Sportage "Missus commuter Bus"
2002 Mitsubishi Rosa Bus (converting it to a motor home)
User avatar
John Green
Mercedes Demigod
Posts: 7677
Joined: Mon 20 Jun, 2005 3:49 am
Model you own: w112
Region: Australian Capital Territory
Location: Canberra-center of the known universe
Contact:

Re: E220 Sluggish

Post by John Green »

Crankshaft position sensors tend to either work or not work. And if faulty as Bart said shouldn't effect the tune.

However, one of the first rules of diagnosis tricky things like this is to fix any of the blindingly obvious problems. So, even though I doubt it will help, I would be replacing the crank angle sensor.
Kind regards, / Mit freundlichen Grüßen,

John Green, Member Institute Automotive Mechanical Engineers


http://mbspares.com.au - Supporting Australia's Mercedes-Benz Enthusiasts.
CraigB
Mercedes Demigod
Posts: 6844
Joined: Thu 23 Jun, 2005 1:18 pm
Model you own: I own multiple different models
Location: Hawthorndene (Adelaide)

Re: E220 Sluggish

Post by CraigB »

I'm driving a E220 with manual trans at the moment and i am really impressed with the pulling power from right down low right through to revving out and sounding like a proper twin cam engine. I'm used to people referring to them as underpowered, but not this UK delivery car and feels more lively than the 300, but not as silky smooth.

My only issue with it is a very low idle, particularly when cold..... need to do some research how to adjust the idle.... but any suggestions welcome!
Craig Baulderstone
280s's
280SE3.5
280SL Ruby
300TE Otto
350SL Gloria
350SLC Lurch
450SEL Boris
500SEC's...including Syd
560SEL's Foufou and Zac
User avatar
John Green
Mercedes Demigod
Posts: 7677
Joined: Mon 20 Jun, 2005 3:49 am
Model you own: w112
Region: Australian Capital Territory
Location: Canberra-center of the known universe
Contact:

Re: E220 Sluggish

Post by John Green »

CraigB wrote: Wed 03 Feb, 2021 4:36 pm My only issue with it is a very low idle, particularly when cold..... need to do some research how to adjust the idle.... but any suggestions welcome!
Idle speed is "in theory" not adjustable. The stepper motor inside the throttle body controls it with input from the ECU. However, the wires inside the throttle body had the same crap biodegradable outer coating as the original wiring looms did and the throttle bodies eventually fail. you can sometime fix them by rewiring them internally.
Kind regards, / Mit freundlichen Grüßen,

John Green, Member Institute Automotive Mechanical Engineers


http://mbspares.com.au - Supporting Australia's Mercedes-Benz Enthusiasts.
CraigB
Mercedes Demigod
Posts: 6844
Joined: Thu 23 Jun, 2005 1:18 pm
Model you own: I own multiple different models
Location: Hawthorndene (Adelaide)

Re: E220 Sluggish

Post by CraigB »

Thanks John - will look into it.
Craig Baulderstone
280s's
280SE3.5
280SL Ruby
300TE Otto
350SL Gloria
350SLC Lurch
450SEL Boris
500SEC's...including Syd
560SEL's Foufou and Zac
User avatar
RavzSa
S Class
Posts: 85
Joined: Tue 05 Mar, 2019 4:32 am
Model you own: w124
Region: Other (please specify below)
Location: South Africa

Re: E220 Sluggish

Post by RavzSa »

So I noticed I've picked up a fault 095

095, Post
Transmission overload protection switch : switch open.

Switch closed and 2nd gear recognised.
!!! With AT. !!!

But from what I read this only affects gear change at full throttle?

I've manually changed the gears whilst in drive and the transmission changes down without a hitch. One thing I did notice was that it was either taking off in a very sluggish 1st gear or second gear because on takeoff there is no difference between drive and 2nd gear.

I understand the 3 markings on the speedo is a guide as to what gear the transmission should be in? I notice that It does change on the marks but instead of changing to 2nd gear on the double mark it actually changes to the 3rd gear.
1993 | W124 | 220E / E220 | WDB1240226B970861 | 230 000km
tomatoes4all
B Class
Posts: 21
Joined: Thu 13 Jul, 2017 12:01 pm
Model you own: w124
Region: Victoria
Location: Grampians NW Victoria

Re: E220 Sluggish

Post by tomatoes4all »

If you select 1 while stationary (at a traffic light for instance, but in South Africa you'd call them robots) and then switch to D while still stationary, upon acceleration the car starts in 1st gear and not in 2nd as it normally would. Cheers, Erik.
User avatar
T-Modell
die Nützlichkeit Meister
Posts: 4159
Joined: Mon 10 Apr, 2006 12:47 am
Model you own: w107
Region: EU- Western
Location: Weinheim Germany
Contact:

Re: E220 Sluggish

Post by T-Modell »

Hi,
I don't know, if there's a misunderstanding regarding the marks on the speedo. The "II" mark means, that this is the maximum speed of the 2nd gear, etc.

Here f. i. the second gear goes up to 130, the third up to 220 and the 4th and last gear does the rest:
Image

Regards
Thomas
---------------------------------------------------------------
1967 W111 250SE Cabriolet, horizon blue
1973 W115 220D 5.0 Pick-Up Argentina, solar orange, "Ute"
1986 R107 500SL, arctic white, the midlife crisis viagra replacement
2007 R171 SLK350, calcit white
2019 W222 S560, ruby black, comfy cruiser
CraigB
Mercedes Demigod
Posts: 6844
Joined: Thu 23 Jun, 2005 1:18 pm
Model you own: I own multiple different models
Location: Hawthorndene (Adelaide)

Re: E220 Sluggish

Post by CraigB »

Firstly, great photo - I am jealous. So you only get to use 4th for 20kmh!

Thomas is correct of course, at the 11 mark it should change into third.

And you can affect the shift points and how it responds to throttle by adjusting the Bowden cable - from accelerator linkage down to trans - tighten it to far and you will have trouble getting it to change up into top - just saying that to explain how it behaves.
Craig Baulderstone
280s's
280SE3.5
280SL Ruby
300TE Otto
350SL Gloria
350SLC Lurch
450SEL Boris
500SEC's...including Syd
560SEL's Foufou and Zac
User avatar
RavzSa
S Class
Posts: 85
Joined: Tue 05 Mar, 2019 4:32 am
Model you own: w124
Region: Other (please specify below)
Location: South Africa

Re: E220 Sluggish

Post by RavzSa »

[/quote]
tomatoes4all wrote: Wed 10 Feb, 2021 8:05 pm If you select 1 while stationary (at a traffic light for instance, but in South Africa you'd call them robots) and then switch to D while still stationary, upon acceleration the car starts in 1st gear and not in 2nd as it normally would. Cheers, Erik.
Unfortunately, no designated first gear in this car. Only selection is D > 3 > 2. I've taken off in drive and then immediately selected 2 but made absolutely no difference so I assumed it was already in second or first gear.
T-Modell wrote: Wed 10 Feb, 2021 8:32 pm Hi,
I don't know, if there's a misunderstanding regarding the marks on the speedo. The "II" mark means, that this is the maximum speed of the 2nd gear, etc.

Here f. i. the second gear goes up to 130, the third up to 220 and the 4th and last gear does the rest:
Image

Regards
Thomas
Thanks for clearing that up. It definitely changes on the marks. Maybe need to tinker with the bowden cable again
1993 | W124 | 220E / E220 | WDB1240226B970861 | 230 000km
User avatar
John Green
Mercedes Demigod
Posts: 7677
Joined: Mon 20 Jun, 2005 3:49 am
Model you own: w112
Region: Australian Capital Territory
Location: Canberra-center of the known universe
Contact:

Re: E220 Sluggish

Post by John Green »

RavzSa wrote: Wed 10 Feb, 2021 6:04 am So I noticed I've picked up a fault 095

095, Post
Transmission overload protection switch : switch open.

Switch closed and 2nd gear recognised.
!!! With AT. !!!
Some markets had a transmission temp sender that would send a signal to the engine ECU if the oil temp in the trans reached a certain point. The engine ECU would then reduce the engine power until such time as the trans oil cooler down enough. So if your car has this switch and if the switch has triggered incorrectly then that could be your problem.
Kind regards, / Mit freundlichen Grüßen,

John Green, Member Institute Automotive Mechanical Engineers


http://mbspares.com.au - Supporting Australia's Mercedes-Benz Enthusiasts.
User avatar
John Green
Mercedes Demigod
Posts: 7677
Joined: Mon 20 Jun, 2005 3:49 am
Model you own: w112
Region: Australian Capital Territory
Location: Canberra-center of the known universe
Contact:

Re: E220 Sluggish

Post by John Green »

722.3.JPG
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Kind regards, / Mit freundlichen Grüßen,

John Green, Member Institute Automotive Mechanical Engineers


http://mbspares.com.au - Supporting Australia's Mercedes-Benz Enthusiasts.
Post Reply