E220 Sluggish
- RavzSa
- S Class
- Posts: 85
- Joined: Tue 05 Mar, 2019 4:32 am
- Model you own: w124
- Region: Other (please specify below)
- Location: South Africa
E220 Sluggish
Hi all,
My 220E / E220 M111 has become sluggish over the years especially on take-off and when going up-hill but once on the freeway and up to about 120km it will easily cruise up to 160km.. Whilst I understand its the little 2.2 I remember it being quite nippy.
There's actually no change in acceleration when the accelerator pedal is about halfway until the floor. The car almost never shifts down and in most instances, I have to press the kick down to get it to shift down. But even when the kick-down is engaged the acceleration does not feel correct.
One thing to note is that it does hold its speed going up-hill but almost impossible to over-take without hitting the kick down.
I've checked the throttle cable and confirmed that the butterfly valve is being correctly activated.
I've done the following so far with little to no change to the acceleration;
1. replaced the fuel pumps (Bosch)
2. replaced the fuel filter (MB)
3. replaced fuel pressure regulator (Chinese)
4. rebuilt and cleaned the throttle actuator
5. changed transmission oil (Dextron 2)
6. changed transmission filter (MB)
7. adjusted Bowden cable.
8. Compression test on all 4 cylinders was consistent and around 13psi
The only fault code on the ECU is a faulty crankshaft sensor but assume this cant impact the acceleration..?
Besides pulling the transmission out, is there anything else to look at?
My 220E / E220 M111 has become sluggish over the years especially on take-off and when going up-hill but once on the freeway and up to about 120km it will easily cruise up to 160km.. Whilst I understand its the little 2.2 I remember it being quite nippy.
There's actually no change in acceleration when the accelerator pedal is about halfway until the floor. The car almost never shifts down and in most instances, I have to press the kick down to get it to shift down. But even when the kick-down is engaged the acceleration does not feel correct.
One thing to note is that it does hold its speed going up-hill but almost impossible to over-take without hitting the kick down.
I've checked the throttle cable and confirmed that the butterfly valve is being correctly activated.
I've done the following so far with little to no change to the acceleration;
1. replaced the fuel pumps (Bosch)
2. replaced the fuel filter (MB)
3. replaced fuel pressure regulator (Chinese)
4. rebuilt and cleaned the throttle actuator
5. changed transmission oil (Dextron 2)
6. changed transmission filter (MB)
7. adjusted Bowden cable.
8. Compression test on all 4 cylinders was consistent and around 13psi
The only fault code on the ECU is a faulty crankshaft sensor but assume this cant impact the acceleration..?
Besides pulling the transmission out, is there anything else to look at?
1993 | W124 | 220E / E220 | WDB1240226B970861 | 230 000km
- Bartman4800
- SLS AMG
- Posts: 2786
- Joined: Fri 10 Oct, 2008 12:10 am
- Model you own: w111
- Location: Perth WA
Re: E220 Sluggish
I suspect the faulty crankshaft sensor will make the engine go into limp mode.
It's an important sensor on the engine and I would suggest to replace it asap.
Regards, Bart
It's an important sensor on the engine and I would suggest to replace it asap.
Regards, Bart
1963 220 Sb Sedan "Kermit" (Australian Assembly)
1960 220 Sb Sedan "Zum Schlachten" (Early German Assembly, with a torsion bar spring for the bonnet) - Stored in Country WA
2012 W212 E250CDI
1981 Subaru Brumby 1.8 with Weber and 5-speed box "little utie" - Sold to another enthusiast!
2006 Ford Focus "daily driver"
2002 VW Passat V6 30V Station Wagon (SOLD - This car into a money pit)
2011 Kia Sportage "Missus commuter Bus"
2002 Mitsubishi Rosa Bus (converting it to a motor home)
1960 220 Sb Sedan "Zum Schlachten" (Early German Assembly, with a torsion bar spring for the bonnet) - Stored in Country WA
2012 W212 E250CDI
1981 Subaru Brumby 1.8 with Weber and 5-speed box "little utie" - Sold to another enthusiast!
2006 Ford Focus "daily driver"
2002 VW Passat V6 30V Station Wagon (SOLD - This car into a money pit)
2011 Kia Sportage "Missus commuter Bus"
2002 Mitsubishi Rosa Bus (converting it to a motor home)
- John Green
- Mercedes Demigod
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- Joined: Mon 20 Jun, 2005 3:49 am
- Model you own: w112
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Re: E220 Sluggish
Crankshaft position sensors tend to either work or not work. And if faulty as Bart said shouldn't effect the tune.
However, one of the first rules of diagnosis tricky things like this is to fix any of the blindingly obvious problems. So, even though I doubt it will help, I would be replacing the crank angle sensor.
However, one of the first rules of diagnosis tricky things like this is to fix any of the blindingly obvious problems. So, even though I doubt it will help, I would be replacing the crank angle sensor.
Kind regards, / Mit freundlichen Grüßen,
John Green, Member Institute Automotive Mechanical Engineers
http://mbspares.com.au - Supporting Australia's Mercedes-Benz Enthusiasts.
John Green, Member Institute Automotive Mechanical Engineers
http://mbspares.com.au - Supporting Australia's Mercedes-Benz Enthusiasts.
-
- Mercedes Demigod
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Re: E220 Sluggish
I'm driving a E220 with manual trans at the moment and i am really impressed with the pulling power from right down low right through to revving out and sounding like a proper twin cam engine. I'm used to people referring to them as underpowered, but not this UK delivery car and feels more lively than the 300, but not as silky smooth.
My only issue with it is a very low idle, particularly when cold..... need to do some research how to adjust the idle.... but any suggestions welcome!
My only issue with it is a very low idle, particularly when cold..... need to do some research how to adjust the idle.... but any suggestions welcome!
Craig Baulderstone
280s's
280SE3.5
280SL Ruby
300TE Otto
350SL Gloria
350SLC Lurch
450SEL Boris
500SEC's...including Syd
560SEL's Foufou and Zac
280s's
280SE3.5
280SL Ruby
300TE Otto
350SL Gloria
350SLC Lurch
450SEL Boris
500SEC's...including Syd
560SEL's Foufou and Zac
- John Green
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Re: E220 Sluggish
Idle speed is "in theory" not adjustable. The stepper motor inside the throttle body controls it with input from the ECU. However, the wires inside the throttle body had the same crap biodegradable outer coating as the original wiring looms did and the throttle bodies eventually fail. you can sometime fix them by rewiring them internally.
Kind regards, / Mit freundlichen Grüßen,
John Green, Member Institute Automotive Mechanical Engineers
http://mbspares.com.au - Supporting Australia's Mercedes-Benz Enthusiasts.
John Green, Member Institute Automotive Mechanical Engineers
http://mbspares.com.au - Supporting Australia's Mercedes-Benz Enthusiasts.
-
- Mercedes Demigod
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Re: E220 Sluggish
Thanks John - will look into it.
Craig Baulderstone
280s's
280SE3.5
280SL Ruby
300TE Otto
350SL Gloria
350SLC Lurch
450SEL Boris
500SEC's...including Syd
560SEL's Foufou and Zac
280s's
280SE3.5
280SL Ruby
300TE Otto
350SL Gloria
350SLC Lurch
450SEL Boris
500SEC's...including Syd
560SEL's Foufou and Zac
- RavzSa
- S Class
- Posts: 85
- Joined: Tue 05 Mar, 2019 4:32 am
- Model you own: w124
- Region: Other (please specify below)
- Location: South Africa
Re: E220 Sluggish
So I noticed I've picked up a fault 095
095, Post
Transmission overload protection switch : switch open.
Switch closed and 2nd gear recognised.
!!! With AT. !!!
But from what I read this only affects gear change at full throttle?
I've manually changed the gears whilst in drive and the transmission changes down without a hitch. One thing I did notice was that it was either taking off in a very sluggish 1st gear or second gear because on takeoff there is no difference between drive and 2nd gear.
I understand the 3 markings on the speedo is a guide as to what gear the transmission should be in? I notice that It does change on the marks but instead of changing to 2nd gear on the double mark it actually changes to the 3rd gear.
095, Post
Transmission overload protection switch : switch open.
Switch closed and 2nd gear recognised.
!!! With AT. !!!
But from what I read this only affects gear change at full throttle?
I've manually changed the gears whilst in drive and the transmission changes down without a hitch. One thing I did notice was that it was either taking off in a very sluggish 1st gear or second gear because on takeoff there is no difference between drive and 2nd gear.
I understand the 3 markings on the speedo is a guide as to what gear the transmission should be in? I notice that It does change on the marks but instead of changing to 2nd gear on the double mark it actually changes to the 3rd gear.
1993 | W124 | 220E / E220 | WDB1240226B970861 | 230 000km
-
- B Class
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- Joined: Thu 13 Jul, 2017 12:01 pm
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- Region: Victoria
- Location: Grampians NW Victoria
Re: E220 Sluggish
If you select 1 while stationary (at a traffic light for instance, but in South Africa you'd call them robots) and then switch to D while still stationary, upon acceleration the car starts in 1st gear and not in 2nd as it normally would. Cheers, Erik.
- T-Modell
- die Nützlichkeit Meister
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Re: E220 Sluggish
Hi,
I don't know, if there's a misunderstanding regarding the marks on the speedo. The "II" mark means, that this is the maximum speed of the 2nd gear, etc.
Here f. i. the second gear goes up to 130, the third up to 220 and the 4th and last gear does the rest:
Regards
Thomas
I don't know, if there's a misunderstanding regarding the marks on the speedo. The "II" mark means, that this is the maximum speed of the 2nd gear, etc.
Here f. i. the second gear goes up to 130, the third up to 220 and the 4th and last gear does the rest:
Regards
Thomas
---------------------------------------------------------------
1967 W111 250SE Cabriolet, horizon blue
1973 W115 220D 5.0 Pick-Up Argentina, solar orange, "Ute"
1986 R107 500SL, arctic white, the midlife crisis viagra replacement
2007 R171 SLK350, calcit white
2019 W222 S560, ruby black, comfy cruiser
1967 W111 250SE Cabriolet, horizon blue
1973 W115 220D 5.0 Pick-Up Argentina, solar orange, "Ute"
1986 R107 500SL, arctic white, the midlife crisis viagra replacement
2007 R171 SLK350, calcit white
2019 W222 S560, ruby black, comfy cruiser
-
- Mercedes Demigod
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Re: E220 Sluggish
Firstly, great photo - I am jealous. So you only get to use 4th for 20kmh!
Thomas is correct of course, at the 11 mark it should change into third.
And you can affect the shift points and how it responds to throttle by adjusting the Bowden cable - from accelerator linkage down to trans - tighten it to far and you will have trouble getting it to change up into top - just saying that to explain how it behaves.
Thomas is correct of course, at the 11 mark it should change into third.
And you can affect the shift points and how it responds to throttle by adjusting the Bowden cable - from accelerator linkage down to trans - tighten it to far and you will have trouble getting it to change up into top - just saying that to explain how it behaves.
Craig Baulderstone
280s's
280SE3.5
280SL Ruby
300TE Otto
350SL Gloria
350SLC Lurch
450SEL Boris
500SEC's...including Syd
560SEL's Foufou and Zac
280s's
280SE3.5
280SL Ruby
300TE Otto
350SL Gloria
350SLC Lurch
450SEL Boris
500SEC's...including Syd
560SEL's Foufou and Zac
- RavzSa
- S Class
- Posts: 85
- Joined: Tue 05 Mar, 2019 4:32 am
- Model you own: w124
- Region: Other (please specify below)
- Location: South Africa
Re: E220 Sluggish
[/quote]
Unfortunately, no designated first gear in this car. Only selection is D > 3 > 2. I've taken off in drive and then immediately selected 2 but made absolutely no difference so I assumed it was already in second or first gear.tomatoes4all wrote: ↑Wed 10 Feb, 2021 8:05 pm If you select 1 while stationary (at a traffic light for instance, but in South Africa you'd call them robots) and then switch to D while still stationary, upon acceleration the car starts in 1st gear and not in 2nd as it normally would. Cheers, Erik.
Thanks for clearing that up. It definitely changes on the marks. Maybe need to tinker with the bowden cable againT-Modell wrote: ↑Wed 10 Feb, 2021 8:32 pm Hi,
I don't know, if there's a misunderstanding regarding the marks on the speedo. The "II" mark means, that this is the maximum speed of the 2nd gear, etc.
Here f. i. the second gear goes up to 130, the third up to 220 and the 4th and last gear does the rest:
Regards
Thomas
1993 | W124 | 220E / E220 | WDB1240226B970861 | 230 000km
- John Green
- Mercedes Demigod
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- Joined: Mon 20 Jun, 2005 3:49 am
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Re: E220 Sluggish
Some markets had a transmission temp sender that would send a signal to the engine ECU if the oil temp in the trans reached a certain point. The engine ECU would then reduce the engine power until such time as the trans oil cooler down enough. So if your car has this switch and if the switch has triggered incorrectly then that could be your problem.
Kind regards, / Mit freundlichen Grüßen,
John Green, Member Institute Automotive Mechanical Engineers
http://mbspares.com.au - Supporting Australia's Mercedes-Benz Enthusiasts.
John Green, Member Institute Automotive Mechanical Engineers
http://mbspares.com.au - Supporting Australia's Mercedes-Benz Enthusiasts.
- John Green
- Mercedes Demigod
- Posts: 7677
- Joined: Mon 20 Jun, 2005 3:49 am
- Model you own: w112
- Region: Australian Capital Territory
- Location: Canberra-center of the known universe
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Re: E220 Sluggish
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Kind regards, / Mit freundlichen Grüßen,
John Green, Member Institute Automotive Mechanical Engineers
http://mbspares.com.au - Supporting Australia's Mercedes-Benz Enthusiasts.
John Green, Member Institute Automotive Mechanical Engineers
http://mbspares.com.au - Supporting Australia's Mercedes-Benz Enthusiasts.