W115 Ute Project starts ...

Post by **T-Modell** » Sat 23 May, 2015 9:44 pm

Hi all,

after 9 months and with a lot of help from my Argentine friend (without him it would be impossible), the W115 pickup is finally bought ... still in Argentina:

ef43427a7c4234538f4fadf0775b6874.jpg

1a19ba4041575f86375d68556bc75d5e.jpg

Additionally I bought a W115 "rural" station wagon, our local club here takes it. As they both fit in one container, we share the shipping cost.

9c41efef5d54272a2e89d83e11791bcf.jpg

Once it's here in Germany it will be stripped down completely, welded and the planned V8 conversion starts. At the moment I have two options, I will follow from next week on:
1) Get the SLC front and rear axles and a W126 500/560 SEC donor car for motor gearbox etc.
2) Get a pre-1985-facelift R107 500 SL and everything bolts in ...

I'm pretty excited now and I hope those cars arrive safely in Germany ....

Regards
Thomas

Post by **Giles** » Sat 23 May, 2015 10:37 pm

Brilliant news Thomas, I thought the project had been abandoned.

Looking forward to progress reports with plent of photos.

Giles

Post by **New123** » Sat 23 May, 2015 10:58 pm

Post by **T-Modell** » Tue 26 May, 2015 9:46 pm

So I cross my fingers ... with a little bit of luck I have a donor car, a 1984 R107 500SL. Delivered in Germany, the privately exported to Japan ... arrived back this week. I'm in contact with the importer.

4IuzCwB6LtZC4m4brftylaI7anHiIldPS4V04oiaselrjWw7Ekw7O2Qfz3tJfMOFStdJDZPI7y-0s0XOIWFvG8iFbZ.jpg

It's a bit more expensive, but a pre-1985 SL should bolt in as it is ... wish me luck :occasion5:

Thomas

Post by **McGavin** » Wed 27 May, 2015 7:08 pm

The ute and wagon look fantastic, so does the poor donor car, good luck Thomas.

Post by **Greg in Oz** » Wed 27 May, 2015 11:19 pm

T-Modell wrote:So I cross my fingers ... with a little bit of luck I have a donor car, a 1984 R107 500SL. Delivered in Germany, the privately exported to Japan ... arrived back this week. I'm in contact with the importer.
4IuzCwB6LtZC4m4brftylaI7anHiIldPS4V04oiaselrjWw7Ekw7O2Qfz3tJfMOFStdJDZPI7y-0s0XOIWFvG8iFbZ.jpg
It's a bit more expensive, but a pre-1985 SL should bolt in as it is ... wish me luck :occasion5:

Thomas

How times have changed. The thought of using a 500SL as a donor for a modified W115 would have been never been considered once. An SL in any condition was always way more valuable than any sedan.

Post by **T-Modell** » Wed 27 May, 2015 11:59 pm

Greg,

it's the cheaper solution all in all. Everything fits and all the hassle with getting parts here and there is not there.

Calculation: SL approx. 12.500 EUR; for the rest of the car I get at least 4-5.000 Euros (bumpers here around 1.000 each, lights 450 each etc etc). If I get a 6-7000 W126 I need the SLC axles, oil sump, etc. etc. nothing fits. With the R107 I can take the ABS, cruise control, brakes as it is. AND I might have the possibility to use the Pentas of the SL ... another 1.000-1.500 Euros saved ...

AND the good news: I get it registered with a pre-1985 107 :occasion5: :occasion5: :occasion5: ... just came back! The message between the lines was that he wouldn't accept a 560.

With my best regards
Thomas

Post by **Giles** » Thu 28 May, 2015 9:57 am

Short cut everything Thomas, just put a flat tray on the SL.

Das-Bogan style. :dance:

Giles

Post by **Greg in Oz** » Thu 28 May, 2015 10:25 am

Giles wrote:Short cut everything Thomas, just put a flat tray on the SL.

Das-Bogan style. :dance:

Giles

107 SL ute. I like the sound of that!

Post by **T-Modell** » Thu 28 May, 2015 3:45 pm

Jealous bunch of Aussies

... I might reconsider offering the AMG spoilers here on the forum :whistle:

With happy regards
Thomas

Post by **AMG** » Thu 28 May, 2015 6:31 pm

Thomas,

Are those genuine ATS 16x8 ET11 Penta rims on the SL ???

:occasion5: :occasion5:

Post by **T-Modell** » Thu 28 May, 2015 11:07 pm

AMG wrote:Thomas,

Are those genuine ATS 16x8 ET11 Penta rims on the SL ??? :occasion5: :occasion5:

I have no idea; the pimp-up was obviously done in Japan ... so I will see when I see the car ... I don't have more photos than these ... who wants the steering wheel?

v2m5autRSmJqkauwL0dnmpnmU1zCVdcXn18Ordv5p8VyTjSMWfjeuxy0epexLO52IuqDcaH-0s0XOIWFvG8iFbZ.jpg

2myH0mB6pRbXOKYBdiw8sG6aHqFz86X1jPHliubNH1uBU7NcloLJqMibwicEqcjZ60jE2yrBa-0s0XOIWFvG8iFbZ.jpg

Thomas

Post by **AMG** » Fri 29 May, 2015 7:12 am

Yum :occasion5:

Post by **John Green** » Fri 29 May, 2015 1:10 pm

Thomas what are your plans for relocating the brake booster and other fire wall mods to fit the engine in? I presume you know that the engine bay is the same width but dramatically different in depth. :whistle: :whistle:

Post by **T-Modell** » Fri 29 May, 2015 4:16 pm

John Green wrote:Thomas what are your plans for relocating the brake booster and other fire wall mods to fit the engine in? I presume you know that the engine bay is the same width but dramatically different in depth. :whistle: :whistle:

John,

I was told, that it fits (incl. Mercmad) ... in Frankfurt someone has put a V8 into a /8, so I can ask there (he's the one who puts a 5.6 into a W111 Coupe at the moment) ... but if you know more, please let me know ...

Best regards
Thomas

Edit: That's a picture of the W111 engine bay, where the 5.6 definitely fits (everything was already built in, this is after the paint job):

IMG_0069_1024x768.JPG

Post by **John Green** » Fri 29 May, 2015 8:50 pm

Any V8 into a W111 is easy, the worst you have to deal with is the tunnel needs to be opened up on the earlier versions. We have put a M117 in a W114 as a test fit and decided to not proceed... On a RHD the brake booster would have to be relocated and I suspect the same would be the case with a LHD.

I cant remember the exact dimensions but if you measure from the engine mounting points to the fire wall on a W107 and a W114/5 the difference is around 7cms and this is what makes it so tricky. I have often wondered how the few conversions I have seen have been done? My guess is that they move the engine forward a little and make up a custom oil pan so that the sump still fits into the W114/5 subframe. Also don't forget that you will need to reinforce the W114/5 subframe rear lower control arm mounts.

Post by **Giles** » Fri 29 May, 2015 11:00 pm

Would it be possible to move the engine forward and deleting the OEM fan and replacing with thermo's?

The other point I've wonder would the trans fit in the tunnel?

I have a dummy C114 coupe that awaits a M117 (380/trans experiment donor) implant.

Firewall rearrangement is a possibility if required. Any 500SL donations would be great fully accepted.

Giles

Post by **T-Modell** » Sat 30 May, 2015 12:06 am

John,

we will see. I have been told that it's possible without changing the firewall and we're taking the complete axles from the R107. The only picture I fould so far is this here:

560W114.jpg

But as we strip down the whole car, we could change the firewall if necessary. Ron told me, that he has seen W114 5.6 with everything still in place ... I'm pretty sure, we find a solution

Thomas

Post by **John Green** » Sat 30 May, 2015 8:46 am

As I often explain to people asking about quotes for modification, "anything is possible if you have the time and money". Looking at a few engine bay shots the brake booster location is not as bad in a LHD car, but I still think it will be an issue. Compare this shot to the one with the V8 in it.

V8 version almost looks like the booster and master cyl are on a bit of an angle.

Post by **Giles** » Sat 30 May, 2015 9:24 am

This, according to what I've been told, is a 380 in a C114 located in South Africa.

image.jpg

Giles

Post by **John Green** » Sat 30 May, 2015 9:43 am

Here is the post for 5 years ago:

viewtopic.php?f=30&t=13098&p=89946&hilit=W114+V8#p89946

I also remember that we removed the fire wall padding as it was that tight. We were however looking at if it would fit in using the standard engine mount legs. Where possible I like our conversion to use as many genuine MB parts as possible. It give them that " wow MB really did build these" kind of look. Move it forward and to the left (or right for you) and it should work, but you will then be getting into making lots of custom bits.

Post by **Giles** » Sat 30 May, 2015 10:11 am

I'd forgotten how Ginger looked like before I picked her up. Well she's close to an engine implant soon, albeit an M110.

Many thanks for the warp speed delivery of the 4 speed shifter John. At least for now I have less to do to get some progress happening. The 5 speed will get an overhaul at some stage.

Thomas, I eagerly await some progress on your project and will note what it takes to create the outcome.

Post by **T-Modell** » Sat 30 May, 2015 4:09 pm

Thanks guys for the input,

I have to trust the people here I spoke to and have made it before (also W123). This week I was at a really good company around the corner (60kms in Aussie terms, Polish guys) ... they were really impressive. Everytime I asked a question "can you do that" I got that pity look ... they restored a 190SL from scratch, Pagode, Corvette, Bentley etc etc. They had a W114 Coupe completely stripped down to the metal and explained, what they cut out and replace after sanding (they ship the car to Poland for sanding!).

@Giles: I haven't yet got a shipping date, the car is still in Argentina. The earliest time to start will be at least August. If that works out, my intention is to finish next spring (sorry, our spring, March/April 2016).

@All, reg. donor car: I've agreed with the importer, that I take the car at the end of June and he'll take off the bumpers, lights, fenders, dashboard, trunk lid and some other parts I don't need (they've become really expensive here). The complete car was 12.500 + tax (14.850 EUR), We agreed on a price of 10.000 EUR inkl. tax. And he offered to take the rest of the car after the conversion back to a price we have to agree. All in all it's a fair deal imho.

With my best regards
Thomas

Edit: I just read the pdf-document in the other thread "V8 in W114": he says, that the booster had to be moved sideways 60mm (minor modifications at the fender) and 45mm to the front (cable exit)

Post by **T-Modell** » Sat 27 Jun, 2015 12:02 am

Hello,

so, donor car is bought! :occasion5: .... exactly the right car for the project, had a front accident (badly repaired), badly painted (was originally petrol), but nice; all the parts I don't need are a bit run down, but motor/gearbox are pretty good. Also the stainless steel exhaust looks pretty new and the plan is to extend it and put in underneath the Pick-Up ... another 1.000 Euros saved.

One question regarding the pentas: The rear wheels show "Penta" and all the other data, the front wheels only the size ... can anyone tell me, what that is? Are they original? The steering wheel is originally made in Italy for AMG ... or in Italian English "Exclusive made for AMG"

Thomas

Rear wheel:

Front wheel:

Post by **T-Modell** » Tue 28 Jul, 2015 4:51 pm

Well,

after another two months since purchasing the vehicles I FINALLY got an email from the shipping company that they're willing to move :occasion5: ... so hopefully the cars are on their way in the next four weeks ...

But I wasn't unproductive ... the last 4 weeks I worked hours and hours on "my" fiddle project of how to put a (huge) R107 cluster into a W114 box (much smaller) ... so after a lot of cutting, soldering, glueing etc. ... this is the prototype:

Lighting still has to be done, function test etc. The plate here is still a cardboard mock-up, a friend of mine in Austria will produce it for me with a water-cutting machine. Plexiglass is already here ... this comes on top, also cut to measure with a water-cutting machine. The control lights are from a W124 cluster btw ... they are much smaller, I couldn't fit the R107 lights into it. I could even cut the reset arm of the speedometer so it works ...

I hope, when I connect it again to the donor car, something will still work

Here some steps in-between ... while I was at it I repaced the capacitors of the clock ...

Thomas

Post by **Greg in Oz** » Tue 28 Jul, 2015 5:11 pm

Nice work! It is all the "minor details" like this that hardly anyone notices but takes huge amounts of time with a project like this.

Post by **pastelgrey300D** » Tue 28 Jul, 2015 6:16 pm

That's great! I'm surprised that all the guts of the 107 dash even fit within the shell of the 114 cluster. Have seen lots of w114s where the clock has been replaced with a tacho but never a custom one like this. Should look very factory when its done too!

Post by **T-Modell** » Tue 28 Jul, 2015 6:57 pm

Thanks,

pastelgrey300D wrote:That's great! I'm surprised that all the guts of the 107 dash even fit within the shell of the 114 cluster. ...

The only thing that I don't build in is the dimmer, it's really a tight squeeze and - honestly - I don't need it. So far all my cars are on max illumination, so I leave it out.

it was much more complicated than I thought ... here's the parts before I started cutting ...

Lot of extra wires etc. I bought a whole W124 cluster (also to find out how to reset the km-counter) and used parts of it.

Thomas

Post by **KimB** » Tue 28 Jul, 2015 7:18 pm

Thomas
Great project as I love Merc Utes!
I also have to ask is that you in the denim skirt in the engine bay shot?

Cheers
Kim

Post by **T-Modell** » Tue 28 Jul, 2015 7:19 pm

KimB wrote:Thomas
...
I also have to ask is that you in the denim skirt in the engine bay shot?
Cheers
Kim

No Kim,

I wore the little black one, that's my wife

Thomas

Post by **T-Modell** » Tue 04 Aug, 2015 7:43 pm

Well,

when you fiddle, of course things go wrong ... some days ago I found out, that - I guess - due to drilling or grinding one of the plastic tooth wheels of the clock broke

... so I thought, let's take the W124 clock. The clock itself fitted (only had one instead of two capacitors I replaced), but the adjustment mechanics was different ... so I had to adapt that too.

But it's in now, hands repainted. Next step is the cover and the plexiglass ... and of course a functional test ...

Thomas

Post by **T-Modell** » Fri 07 Aug, 2015 7:46 pm

So, a not so nice update ... since a week it's clear, that - due to the situation in Argentina - it's not easy to get those cars out of the country. First you need a company with an export license (we're looking), then the value of the cars is estimated by their customs, then the money (Euros, Dollars) has to be transferred through the central bank, then a huge pile of forms has to be filled out, and so on and so forth ... I do have a feeling, that soon I will be the owner of a half-dismantled 500SL

... but hope dies last

At least the cluster is finished and sprayed black, hands repainted in bright orange. Next week the drawings for the facing and the glass will be on their way to Austria to be done. Functional test still to be done ... no hurry now, as the cars stand silently in Argentina ...

Best regards
Thomas

Post by **CraigB** » Fri 07 Aug, 2015 8:37 pm

Hi Thomas. Well done. Having spent time over here you would know the local obsession with high power utes - would be good to see you line up at the lights here next to one!

Just checked out the thread and realised you asked questions with no answers.

the 'penta' wheel i believe is a uk copy but still a respected wheel i believe, just not original. The centre caps look correct premerger AMG. The other wheel i am not sure about. The original AMG wheels i have look very similar but have 'AMG' cast in one of the bits between the bolt holes but that could have been ground off. Wheel size maybe is bit bigger font. They are not the ROC copies - also a good respected wheel. I can't remember what the JIL is - is that a standard mark in Europe or an actual foundry. If it wasn't so cold and wet would leave the fire and go and look in the shed for you!

As for steering wheel, i don't know that particular wheel but certainly my AMG wheels are made in italy for AMG by Itolvolanti, so my guess is that is original AMG item.

I'm guessing you need it but if you wanted to sell the sump and oil filter mount I'm in the market for such parts. Saw a 380slc sell here on ebay for something like $2k but space and lower urgency for that project.... and another one always comes up right? Do you know what sort of money they are asking for such items over there or is everyone trying to put alloy engines into older 107s over there too.

Post by **T-Modell** » Fri 07 Aug, 2015 9:08 pm

Hello Craig,

CraigB wrote:Hi Thomas. Well done. Having spent time over here you would know the local obsession with high power utes - would be good to see you line up at the lights here next to one!
...

I've been in Australia 18 times now, so I do know that, especially the bright colours. That's one of the reasons for this pickup project. The only thing funny about those utes in Oz with the huge V8s are the front brakes ... HUGE wheels and tiny discs :whistle:

CraigB wrote:...
I'm guessing you need it but if you wanted to sell the sump and oil filter mount I'm in the market for such parts. Saw a 380slc sell here on ebay for something like $2k but space and lower urgency for that project.... and another one always comes up right? Do you know what sort of money they are asking for such items over there or is everyone trying to put alloy engines into older 107s over there too.

Of course I need all of it, motor gearbox, drivetrain, brakes ... but if you like, I can ask Andreas of the "SL slaughter house" (which he sells at the moment, http://www.ebay.de/itm/mercedes-r107-fa ... 2355e2c2c5), if he has those parts and how much he wants for it. He imported my "Original German delivered", but then exported-to-Japan 500SL ... The only thing I need then is a picture or similar what you exactly mean ... I'm not 100% in automotive terms in English ...

Regards
Thomas

Post by **CraigB** » Fri 07 Aug, 2015 9:55 pm

I think if you described that i want to put a 560 engine from a W126 sedan into a R107 350slc, then he will know what bits are needed. Basically the engine oil in a 126 sits in a sump/pan that doesn't fit the 107 and the oil filter sits up and 126 hangs down and wont fit in. I can't find the actual parts, but using german ebay, the following equivalent parts are needed for alloy engine sl/slc, 500 or 380. Exhaust is an issue too but that would be a custom made job. And it is possible to cut and weld the top part of the 126 sump and the bottom of a 350/450 together, but that will have its own costs and nice to have the proper part.

Engine oil sump/pan:
http://www.ebay.de/itm/BMw-e36-TDS-Olwa ... 2a54e0ebab

oil filter housing:
http://www.ebay.de/itm/Mercedes-W107-45 ... 23554f1b8b

Post by **Djenka018** » Fri 07 Aug, 2015 10:13 pm

I would be more inclined to original format perhaps replacing the clock with a 1/min indicator.

Unimog's has a nice one but 1/min is too small:

Or perhaps something modern but replace the LCD with other indicators

BTW I adore these numbers. I wonder if the font is proprietary

Post by **T-Modell** » Fri 07 Aug, 2015 10:16 pm

Hi,
modern is out of the question, as you cannot get a history license here. Even a modern radio "can" be a problem. Taking the original instruments of the R107 just makes the conversion much easier ...
Thomas

Post by **T-Modell** » Wed 09 Sep, 2015 8:34 pm

Hi all,

a short update of my useless project

... due to the economic situation in Argentina, the upcoming elections and the general shortage of hard currency, it is just hughly complicated to import or export anything. For weeks now we're trying to get the deregistration of the previous owners and then we can start the customs procedures with a huge amount of paperwork. I'm close to flying over, "stealing" the cars and driving them myself into a corrupt country to be able to ship them.

My friend just visited me, he apologised "when you don't live there, you have no idea" ... and "my friend, this is Argentina" ...

Maybe I should follow Giles idea ... take the stripped-off SL and put a tray on it ...

Best regards
Thomas

Post by **Giles** » Wed 09 Sep, 2015 8:59 pm

Bring on the SL tray back.

If someone has done this to a VW Type 3, why not.

type 3 ute.jpg

Giles

Post by **pastelgrey300D** » Thu 10 Sep, 2015 2:37 pm

BTW I adore these numbers. I wonder if the font is proprietary

That font is very close to "DIN Mittelschrift" fonts - some characters are slightly different (mainly the 4 and 6) but it is the closest I could find. Here's a copy for you all to use!

din fonts.zip

Post by **Mercmad** » Fri 11 Sep, 2015 3:42 pm

Ital volante sold those wheels to everyone,even fiat and Alfa Romeo. The only exclusive part is the AMG stamped into them .Japan was a big market for AMG pre takeover .It's the best place to find DOHC W126's etc . A mate has a full AMG equipped 107...a 280SL .Even has AMG cams. Ex Japan.

Post by **Ivanerrol** » Fri 11 Sep, 2015 11:12 pm

Saw a W115 ute on the back of a flat top tow truck in St Georges Rd Thornbury this afternoon.
Didn't have a chance to get an image.

Anybody know anything about that ute?

It was a white colour - a little paint faded around the body work. It's not the blue ute that previously was parked around Ivanhoe.

Post by **T-Modell** » Sun 20 Sep, 2015 3:57 pm

Hi down under,

to shorten the waiting time for the cars (still not on the ship), I received some photos ... as you can see a lot of work is waiting

... I can already start looking for a dashboard, new door cards, rear lights ... anyway, hope dies last

... car has been converted to floor shift, but still has the bench in the front ... happy gear shifting

Best regards
Thomas

Post by **Mercmad** » Mon 21 Sep, 2015 7:39 am

Argentina is great example to those who follow Ozlabor politics . From a wealthy country in the 19th Century with full industry and infrastructure to a nation of the very rich surrounded by the destitute who pay enourmous taxes to support the rich and the government. Don't expect the bureaucracy to move in a big hurry there.

i hope you have a reliable contact there. it looks like another in the same colour for sale too.
http://auto.mercadolibre.com.ar/MLA-578 ... z-220d-_JM

Post by **Mercmad** » Mon 21 Sep, 2015 7:43 am

Crayford i think...

Ever asked any of these people how they got their cars out of Argentina?

Post by **pastelgrey300D** » Mon 21 Sep, 2015 11:35 am

^^^ That beige wagon looks really nice! A really well done conversion! Not so sure about the red one...

Post by **Mercmad** » Mon 21 Sep, 2015 1:46 pm

I think the beige one is a Crayford conversion but the red is a Mercedes Argentina job.
heres another version also Argentine but with a lower roof profile.

Post by **T-Modell** » Mon 21 Sep, 2015 4:01 pm

I'm pretty sure, the red one is NOT from Argentina; there's much more than just Crayfords ... Binz, IMA, etc. Here's a photo of "my" rural I bought in Argentina:

You can be assured that we do everything we can to get the cars out. Nothing is easy at the moment there. Things change from year to year, soon there are elections and the economical state there isn't easy either ...

Thomas

Edit: This is the IMA brochure ...

Post by **T-Modell** » Mon 21 Sep, 2015 4:04 pm

Mercmad wrote:... it looks like another in the same colour for sale too.
http://auto.mercadolibre.com.ar/MLA-578 ... z-220d-_JM

No, this is online for more than 1.5 years and this car does not exist ... guess why I know that

Thomas

Post by **Mercmad** » Tue 22 Sep, 2015 4:46 pm

if you look close at the beige one,it has the crayford rear door (Ford Granada ) and the tell tale symptoms of plastic filler in therear 1/4's. They built over 300 of them too. But if you need a few hints on how to V8 your ute... do it American style with a pick up chassis

http://www.hotrodders.com/forum/w114-me ... 786-4.html