W126 Exhaust / Extractor Systems

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W126 Exhaust / Extractor Systems

Postby Panzerkampfwagen CXXVI » Sat 29 Mar, 2008 12:49 am

Hi Guys

looking to get a little more poke and a bit of a nice note out of the M116 3.8l in the W126...

I was wondering if extractors are available? I'm guessing no.... Does anyone have any custom jobs they'd like to share the details of?

Also looking at getting an exhaust, and pondering with the idea of the twin exhausts. Aynone got any recommended combinations? Don't want it loud or drony, but to have a nice rumble on acceleration.

something like these:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xIbHa2HBgyQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cmzp6W_2IVA

Also noticed the fuel pump etc. is on the right side underneath the car. Keen to see how any twin setups have gone around this!

I was thinking 2.25" each side, but maybe that's a bit big for the 2.8l? maybe 2" either side?

Any help/advice/etc would be fantastic
cheers,
Ryley
'88 W126 500SEC HV - Rauchsilber - 17" AMGs, H&R Springs, St/St exhaust, LSD - 200kW
'12 Toyota 86 GTS - The very much sideways poor man's Cayman
'84 Toyota MA61 Supra - 3 litre turbo - ~300kW, ~590Nm - Too much torque for the driveline :'(
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Re: W126 Exhaust / Extractor Systems

Postby Ivanerrol » Sat 29 Mar, 2008 8:33 pm

I.M.H.O.

You may spend big bucks getting the right sound from the exhaust with little performance enhancement.

The Aussie specs ADR Rules robbed the 380's of any "poke". The cars are "detuned" to get the environmental specs in line. - fixed timing and the ECU is set to make the ignition and injection achieve the desired spec.

You would probably better getting more poke with good tuning and maybe changing out the injection system. The current injection system in you car performance is very much affected by the vacuum. Make sure you have no leaks anywhere and replace any rubbers,valves or pipes associated with the vacuum system. Any small loss of vacuum will rob "poke".

The 380 engine especially in the SEL variation is a little bit underwhelming for the size and weight of the cars (nearly two tonnes). The S Class are made for high speed cruising along the autobahns (160 - 200 KMH). Getting to that speed is rather leisurely in the smaller engined cars. The 5 litre (never officially imported to Australia) has the poke you may desire. The 560 in the series two 126's is the seat of the pants thriller.

Of course the best way to get more poke is get a larger engined car. The cost of getting aftermarket go faster gear may outway the cost of changing to a 500 or 560.
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W210 - E240
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Re: W126 Exhaust / Extractor Systems

Postby Panzerkampfwagen CXXVI » Sun 30 Mar, 2008 3:15 pm

Cheers mate, appreciate the great response...

I know if I was chasing real power I'd be better off opting for the better motor... Basically the idea was to get a nice note and any small power gains would be a plus. I didn't think extractors were readily available, and as you said, the amount of time and money in making custom ones would soon outweigh swapping in a bigger motor. The 126 is really just going to be my daily when I don't want to take the Supra out, or if I want to tow the Supra to the track...

I will also note my 380SE is a South African one, and does go surprisingly well (g-tech states 7.5 to 8 seconds to 100, 1/4 in 15.9 @ 92mph) perhaps it doesn't have such emissons controls? I don't know.

The other thing is my friend has a basic aftermarket computer on his celica- and probably looking to upgrade to a direct fire model soon- so I may install this on the 380??? Just an idea, as it would be cheap/free and I can install and tune it myself...

But thanks for your response, a good read! Is the timing controlled by the ECU as well as fuel? I know the original ecu in my 84 Supra only did fuel....
'88 W126 500SEC HV - Rauchsilber - 17" AMGs, H&R Springs, St/St exhaust, LSD - 200kW
'12 Toyota 86 GTS - The very much sideways poor man's Cayman
'84 Toyota MA61 Supra - 3 litre turbo - ~300kW, ~590Nm - Too much torque for the driveline :'(
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Re: W126 Exhaust / Extractor Systems

Postby StreekG » Sun 30 Mar, 2008 4:19 pm

You can get custom made extractors, im looking into it, and i know someone who has them on his 350SE (which also happens to be be pretty worked and equipped with a vortech supercharger) and said it makes a big difference.
1988 500SEC Euro 265hp
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Re: W126 Exhaust / Extractor Systems

Postby Panzerkampfwagen CXXVI » Sun 30 Mar, 2008 6:18 pm

oh yeah, i'd be keen to hear how that goes!!

cheers mate,
Ryley
'88 W126 500SEC HV - Rauchsilber - 17" AMGs, H&R Springs, St/St exhaust, LSD - 200kW
'12 Toyota 86 GTS - The very much sideways poor man's Cayman
'84 Toyota MA61 Supra - 3 litre turbo - ~300kW, ~590Nm - Too much torque for the driveline :'(
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Re: W126 Exhaust / Extractor Systems

Postby Ivanerrol » Sun 30 Mar, 2008 6:38 pm

If you have a S.A. Model 380 then it will not have the ADR specs that restrict the performance.
I had a S.A. 380 SE years ago and it definitely was a much better performer than the Aussie specs.
The timing is set by a resistor in the electronic ignition circuit and not via the ECU.
W202 - C200
W210 - E240
Departed
W202 - C180 - On consignment to nephew
W126 - 380SE , 380SE (Ex SA Import), 560SEL
W124 - 300e, 260e (ex Japan)
W111 220s (Indonesia) 4 speed manual column shift
W123 230
W116 450SEL
W140 420SEL
W210 E240
W209 CLK 240
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Re: W126 Exhaust / Extractor Systems

Postby wjc » Sun 30 Mar, 2008 7:05 pm

Hi Ryley.

Remus make a rear muffler for the w126 v8, this muffler has the right note. You can also remove the front muffler and replace it with a less restrictive one. Any good exhaust fitter can do this centre muffler replacement pretty cheaply.

On my 380sel i have done this replacement on the front and had a sports type straight through muffler put on to replace the large rear muffler. The note is pretty good (not drony). I have had this rear muffler on for 6 months now but will be replacing it with a Remus that i brought s/h.

Improving the air intake system is another thing you might want to try.

Good luck.
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Re: W126 Exhaust / Extractor Systems

Postby AMG » Sun 30 Mar, 2008 9:02 pm

It's a lot easier said than done.

for the m117, there were separate designs depending on the country, side of driver and vehicle the engine went into. and then, there were 'special' manifolds used on 450slc 5.0 m117 motors, and are LHD only. Custom will cost loads- and you will need tuned length headers to make any difference worthwhile. fitting 4-1's in a 126 engine bay is some task.

Your best bet is to have the standard cast iron manifold extrude-honed and then ceramic coated, which gives the best compromise between price and performance... get a nice well made stainless exhaust, with high volume cat converters and free-flowing mufflers / resonators, and you will be okay.

You may need a second mortgage to pay for this...
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Re: W126 Exhaust / Extractor Systems

Postby Ivanerrol » Sun 30 Mar, 2008 9:32 pm

JoeB wrote:It's a lot easier said than done.

for the m117, there were separate designs depending on the country, side of driver and vehicle the engine went into. and then, there were 'special' manifolds used on 450slc 5.0 m117 motors, and are LHD only.


On my S.A. 380 SE, the pipes from the manifold to the first muffler developed holes. Sam at Exhaust City in West Brunswick had to make custom pipes up to fix this. The good thing was it only took a couple of hours to make up and only cost a hundred or so dollars as he used material laying around his workshop.
(This was in 1990 and Sam is no longer with us).
W202 - C200
W210 - E240
Departed
W202 - C180 - On consignment to nephew
W126 - 380SE , 380SE (Ex SA Import), 560SEL
W124 - 300e, 260e (ex Japan)
W111 220s (Indonesia) 4 speed manual column shift
W123 230
W116 450SEL
W140 420SEL
W210 E240
W209 CLK 240
W201 190e 2.6 (ex U.K.)
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Re: W126 Exhaust / Extractor Systems

Postby AMG » Sun 30 Mar, 2008 9:59 pm

downpipes are cheap, relatively speaking - can be time consuming to fit. my reference was to the manifolds and custom extractors- and the accompanying catalytic converters, O2 sensors (inevitably they are siezed in the pipe and require replacement) and that godforsaken rear muffler setup.

it all adds up - a full stainless system wont be cheap these days. I remember the custom s/s twin 2.75 inch full system for the brockodore including new factory grp A 4-1 headers plus resonators and rear shotgun cost me 1400 back in 93...

add a pair of cats and o2 sensors to that, and we'd be looking at nearly 5K todays prices for the same quality job. Titanium would almost be cheaper. :roll: :roll:

any way you look at it, the extractor bit, is the one thats gonna hurt.... and the cat converters.
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Re: W126 Exhaust / Extractor Systems

Postby Ivanerrol » Sun 30 Mar, 2008 10:18 pm

No cats or O2 on a 380 especially a SA import, however still very expensive. :( :oops:
W202 - C200
W210 - E240
Departed
W202 - C180 - On consignment to nephew
W126 - 380SE , 380SE (Ex SA Import), 560SEL
W124 - 300e, 260e (ex Japan)
W111 220s (Indonesia) 4 speed manual column shift
W123 230
W116 450SEL
W140 420SEL
W210 E240
W209 CLK 240
W201 190e 2.6 (ex U.K.)
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Re: W126 Exhaust / Extractor Systems

Postby AMG » Sun 30 Mar, 2008 10:26 pm

no cats OR o2 sensor?

pre-unleaded 126?

has it got the turnpike ECE resistor or a fixed r16?

no cats or o2 drops price by at least 2K.
just muffler and headers. wow so lucky.
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201.034 Blauschwartz Hermann
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Departed:
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Re: W126 Exhaust / Extractor Systems

Postby Ivanerrol » Sun 30 Mar, 2008 10:43 pm

Hi Ryley,

Has your car got one of these in the engine bay? If you have then you should have no cats or O2.. 380's were pre - unleaded in Australia

Image
W202 - C200
W210 - E240
Departed
W202 - C180 - On consignment to nephew
W126 - 380SE , 380SE (Ex SA Import), 560SEL
W124 - 300e, 260e (ex Japan)
W111 220s (Indonesia) 4 speed manual column shift
W123 230
W116 450SEL
W140 420SEL
W210 E240
W209 CLK 240
W201 190e 2.6 (ex U.K.)
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Re: W126 Exhaust / Extractor Systems

Postby Panzerkampfwagen CXXVI » Mon 31 Mar, 2008 5:32 pm

Thanks guys, great read...

Ivanerrol, couldn't find anything like that, but there are definately no catalytic converters or 02 sensors on the car... Went over it today.

i realise a good exhaust is expensive- A full 3" mandrel bent, with one muffler, dump pipe and high-flow cat for the Supra was $1300... and that wasn't stainless steel. Gave a great note, nice and quiet but loud on WOT.

For the 126 I don't want to spend a heap of money, as it's just going to be a daily driver... but very interesting read. I will probably just change the muffler combinations to get the nice V8 burble... As for extractors, I'll just have to keep my eye out...

I worked full time for a year to cover the Supra, don't want to have to do it again for the 126 ;) (Currently at uni)

Thanks for the info though, are there any more differences between the South African and Australian models?
'88 W126 500SEC HV - Rauchsilber - 17" AMGs, H&R Springs, St/St exhaust, LSD - 200kW
'12 Toyota 86 GTS - The very much sideways poor man's Cayman
'84 Toyota MA61 Supra - 3 litre turbo - ~300kW, ~590Nm - Too much torque for the driveline :'(
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Re: W126 Exhaust / Extractor Systems

Postby Greg in Oz » Mon 31 Mar, 2008 9:11 pm

Guys,

Whilst it is getting a bit off topic, the MB models prior to 1986 (introduction of ULP in Oz) did not use EZL ignition and therefore did not have either a fixed or selectable R16 ignition timing programming resistor. They simply used breakerless electronic ignition where the ignition advance curve was determined by the centrifugal and vacuum advance mechanism in the distributor. Obviously without ULP they also did not have catalytic convertors or O2 (lambda) sensor.

From 1986 the ignition system went to EZL which meant the distributor was nothing more than the rotor and cap to send the high voltage to the appropriate spark plugs (and with the introduction of ULP, exhaust catalysts and O2 sensors were added). The timing signal came from the inductive pickup near the flywheel and the advance curve was determined by the EZL module. The R16 programming resistor was a single fixed resistor in some markets (such as AUS and USA) but was the selector as shown above in European markets where the car could be driven through countries with fuels of significantly differing octane ratings. If the selector is marked EZL-KAT it is a catalyst equipped car. If it is marked EZL-RUF or EZL-ECE it is not catalyst equipped. The change to EZL ignition also coincided with the change from purely mechanical K-Jetronic injection to KE-Jetronic which added an ECU to fine tune the fuel mixture.

Sorry for the off topic discussion. It just seemed appropriate to mention it here since since the discussion was heading this way.

Greg
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Re: W126 Exhaust / Extractor Systems

Postby StreekG » Thu 22 May, 2008 10:44 pm

You can get exhaust systems fabbed up pretty cheap these days, the only wallet pain you will feel is custom extractors. I had a quote the other day from a reputed performance exhaust guy for about $1200-1400 and thats without a HPC coating which i wanted to get. Although he looked at my headers and he reckons they are pretty good and might not even be worth getting them made up, unless i've upgraded the computer as you can't do much with the factory W126 units.

My full 2.5" Exhaust system on my old 280CE with stainless resonator and a Genie turbo muffler (which i already had one the previous system on that car) and a couple of dumped exhaust tips i didn't spend more than $600 and it was a quality install, and gave the M110 more midrange power, very noticeable on the highways and freeways, and it sounded awesome!
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