The how much is my car worth thread

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Ivanerrol
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The how much is my car worth thread

Post by Ivanerrol » Sun 03 Mar, 2013 11:21 pm

The forum members are constantly being asked for advice for their opinion of car values.

Some of the threads created end up with many postings and many different points of view.
There are certain comments about some opinions which contain : Some one is trying to talk the price of certain models down etc etc etc.

Here we will try and create a sticky type of thread with logical ideas

Firstly
If a question arises : How much do you think this car is worth - I'm interested in buying or selling.

Here is the answer. : WE DO NOT KNOW.

(a) We haven't seen the car.
(b) The car needs to have had a P.P.I. to give a fair adjustment
(c) Most members here are enthusiasts with some experience - many with some mechanical know how - we are not experts.
(d) Those members who are in the vehicle industry wisely don't give a monetary opinion - most of them - if they comment at all are giving some periphery advice.

If you are looking for an opinion on the selling price of a vehicle.

(a) Check the usual selling locations - Carsales, Drive, Trading Post and Ebay carsales. This may give an indication for the current market.
(b) It's no good looking at Red Book or insurance values - these are often no reflection of the actual market value.
(c) Get a P.P.I. done by a Mercedes specialist - not the RACV, NRMA, RACQ or some such organization. This will help determine your selling price and alleviate a surprise if as potential buyer insists on one.

If your clear coat has gone or started to go then a panel or whole respray is required. No patch up job is successful
W123's, W124's W126's all suffered from expensive problems - Transmissions and overhead valve head gear - the V8's suffer timing chain problem.
It doesn't matter how many dollars you have put into your car if these important areas haven't been addressed. - a P.P.I. will suss these problems out and drive a potential buyer away.
The cost to do the valve gear on the sixes - M110 and M103 is reasonable - the cost to do this job on the eights is mind bending.
The valve gears will need to be done on the sixes between 150 - 300 thousand K's - The eights - over 350 thousand K's.
Older models require specialist advice. You will need to go to a specialist. Same goes for S.L's of any era.
Modifications will turn off the enthusiasts. So make sure if you have done modification have the parts to restore the car to original

As a seller you have a market of two. Enthusiasts and the novice Benz buyer. The enthusiasts will know that a P.P.I. s required. Before they subject your car to this they will look for a few things
(a) The transmission - it will need to have no clunks, slips or abnormalities.
(b) They will drive the car until it's warmed up then get out and rev the car hard and watch the exhaust. If they see smoke they will know there maybe a potential valve job required. If it's a V8 they will walk away.
(c) panels - repairs and or rust.
(d) Outsize wheels and tyres will stuff-up the suspension - there is no exception to this rule.

Novices look at none of these things and it will be up to your marketing skills to get a sale.

When marketing your car you will need
High quality images. - not poxy fone ones. Check out the professional ads on the internet - see how they pros do their images. Get a proper digital P&S camera and a tripod and mimic the pros images.
Make sure you get an engine compartment and dash / cluster image.
Clear description of the vehicle
State Kilometers traveled.
Service records - if they exist or highlight what you have done (Have evidence to hand)
Put your VIN number and or rego number on the as so the potential enthusiast buyer can check out the legals or the datasheet.
Bullet points are easy for the potential buyer to read - list the good and bad points.

Check out the potential market weeks or months ahead to gauge prices.
Enthusiasts constantly check the market and when the spot a potential bargain they will go for it. M.B.'s were expensive and bought by conservative people. There are still a lot of these cars around coming on the market.

Cars which either have dicky transmissions and or are potentially requiring a overhead valve job and have no Rego or RWC are worth : ....................................Sweet F.A.

If you are on the market to buy a M.B.

There is only one piece of advice - get a Pre Purchase Inspection.

M.B.s were expensive new and are still expensive to keep.
If you buy a W140 or W129 you are potentially buying a grief machine. (I will be potentially :director: for this statement by :angry4: owners of those vehicles).
Older M.B.'s are expensive on fuels so bear this in mind if you are looking for a daily driver.

Others will no doubt contribute their ideas to this thread,
W211 - E240
W204 - C280
W210 - E240
Departed
W202 - C200, C180, C180
W126 - 380SE , 380SE (Ex SA Import), 560SEL
W124 - 300e, 260e (ex Japan)
W111 220s (Indonesia) 4 speed manual column shift
W123 230
W116 450SEL
W140 420SEL
W210 E240
W209 CLK 240
W201 190e 2.6 (ex U.K.)

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Re: The how much is my car worth thread

Post by KimB » Mon 04 Mar, 2013 10:34 am

I agree with all the above. Well done Ivanerrol!
Cheers
Kim
W126 86 300SE Champagne
W126 84 380SEC Signal Red

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DBW124
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Re: The how much is my car worth thread

Post by DBW124 » Mon 04 Mar, 2013 10:59 am

Great post. Maybe this should head each Model Page under "Star Shots...."
Last edited by DBW124 on Mon 04 Mar, 2013 11:07 am, edited 1 time in total.
W124 E 280

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Hendrik
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Re: The how much is my car worth thread

Post by Hendrik » Mon 04 Mar, 2013 11:06 am

Well that's just halved the value of old Mercs :laughing5:
Seriously though, well written and I second the motion of sticking it into a place of prominence, such as general MB related and cars for sale/wanted.

Although you omitted gumtree as a source for car valuations.
Perhaps also add that a recent concourse trophy will add value to top notch vehicles. In other words this car has been independently judged to be of very high standard.
Also when it comes to presentation, detail the interior and exterior, no one likes other peoples rubbish or 'family stickers' on a new to them car. However don't clean the engine bay, a freshly detailed engine bay is always a bit suss, especially if the rest of the car has not been cleaned.

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Re: The how much is my car worth thread

Post by Jonathan_Essling » Tue 05 Mar, 2013 6:02 am

Ivanerrol: always great value:grin:

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The how much is my car worth thread

Post by chrisobee » Tue 05 Mar, 2013 11:29 pm

well said, even though my last post probably instigated this thread ;) apologies!

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number2 190
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Re: The how much is my car worth thread

Post by number2 190 » Sat 09 Mar, 2013 8:50 am

Well written!

I cannot stress this point enough!

'When marketing your car you will need
High quality images. - not poxy fone ones. Check out the professional ads on the internet - see how they pros do their images. Get a proper digital P&S camera and a tripod and mimic the pros images.
Make sure you get an engine compartment and dash / cluster image.'

I have sold a few cars in recent times and they have generally sold quickly due to high quality images. We live in a 'one click' worldwide/Australia wide world and your images are paramount and may even snare you a buyer interstate, or if your car is extra special, overseas! The amount of big dollar cars I look at on the web with dodgy photos is absurd. Even if people do go out and buy a digital camera, 75% don't know what to take photos of or how to frame them.
As a guide, you need:
Front 3/4 left and right. Rear 3/4 Left and right. Interior though front doors left and right. Interior through rear doors left and right. Dash cluster. Engine bay. Boot space. Then take a bunch of detail pics of any points of interest or concern (not necessarily for the initial ad) that you can send to potential far away buyers.

If you feel that this may be too tricky....contact someone who knows what to do. My business model is to do just that, and for $99, it's a small percentage of the end value that could take weeks or months off your sell time.
Got the Benz disease....and I like it!!!



1987 Mercedes 230TE - The Ox!
1969 BMW 2002
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Ivanerrol
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Re: The how much is my car worth thread

Post by Ivanerrol » Sat 09 Mar, 2013 10:25 am

Here's another tip on cameras.

With a digital point and shoot you can set it right down to take images for web size.
You don't need a 12 megapixel camera image.

My image are downsized and cropped to between 50 - 150Kb.

There's a free image processor called Picassa you can download. It's simple to use

Most images from smartphones come out the same size as the internal image processor is set for - My iPhone is 8 Megapixels - far too much.

Too make a decent image from a smart phone requires some technical knowledge or complete pot luck.
A digital point and shoot is far easier

Take images on a bright cloudy day - early in the morning is a good time.
Too much sunshine will just produce glare and reflections.
Don't take images under trees - you get a mottled image.
Make sure the car is not wet.
Don't get your own reflection in the image.
You are trying to sell your car - not your girlfriend, dog or the house behind. Choose an area where the background will not distract the viewer from the point at hand - your car.
If your car is registered don't block out the rego plates. - you are not trying to hide anything. Show your rego label.
Take an image of your speedo and odometer - you are not trying to hide anything.

if you take enough good clean sharp images and put up a good description the calls you get will be from someone who wants to come and see the car.
It's pretty frustrating if you get a call, they ask for the amount of Kilometers on the odometer and then hang up straight away if they don't like the answer.
W211 - E240
W204 - C280
W210 - E240
Departed
W202 - C200, C180, C180
W126 - 380SE , 380SE (Ex SA Import), 560SEL
W124 - 300e, 260e (ex Japan)
W111 220s (Indonesia) 4 speed manual column shift
W123 230
W116 450SEL
W140 420SEL
W210 E240
W209 CLK 240
W201 190e 2.6 (ex U.K.)

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Hendrik
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Re: The how much is my car worth thread

Post by Hendrik » Sat 09 Mar, 2013 12:07 pm

A couple more tips, center the steering wheel, it's only a small thing but when car manufacturers take pictures of their cars, they don't have the steering wheel at an angle. It makes the interior look a touch tidier.
If you have a dash mat, take it off and be honest about the state of the dash. Close up pictures of the tyre tread is not necessary but a description of the condition and brand is. Eg. Michelin Pilot pro 195/65/15 with 40% on front and 70% tread on rear.
Also if you're taking pictures, perhaps drive the car to a nice scenic spot, there again you are trying to imitate the car manufacturers. You are selling a dream and a dirty car parked by the side of the road covered in leaves is not what people dream about.
Also perhaps you can take a video of stating the car and posting it on youtube or such.
Sort of like this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=If08k_gpyR8
This one is a tad long http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P6Fcqaeqrvo if you are going to produce an epic, do the basics first and then go into detail.
This will show that all the warning lights come on and go off, oil pressure rises as it should. Do a walk around with the car running to show that the engine sounds nice and the note from the exhaust is also good.
End of the day a good ad will make any potential buyer fell that he/she is dealing with someone who has their head screwed on and not some stoned lamer trying to flog off a thrashed piece of junk.
Quality ads tend to attract quality buyers, or so the theory goes.

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Re: The how much is my car worth thread

Post by Ivanerrol » Sun 10 Mar, 2013 10:56 am

W211 - E240
W204 - C280
W210 - E240
Departed
W202 - C200, C180, C180
W126 - 380SE , 380SE (Ex SA Import), 560SEL
W124 - 300e, 260e (ex Japan)
W111 220s (Indonesia) 4 speed manual column shift
W123 230
W116 450SEL
W140 420SEL
W210 E240
W209 CLK 240
W201 190e 2.6 (ex U.K.)

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sealion
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Re: The how much is my car worth thread

Post by sealion » Sun 10 Mar, 2013 12:33 pm

Good one Ivanerrol & a fine example of the W210 Marque for it's age... :drool:

I was tempted to put a bid on it myself but the lack of engine bay photo surprised me with such a good external presentation, & the $1000 estimate to ship to Perth WA was a game changer... :think:

John... :whistle:
Sealion - Perth (Bullsbrook) WA
1998 E320 Elegance, Azurite Blue (code 366)

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Re: The how much is my car worth thread

Post by gjlockyer » Mon 12 Oct, 2015 7:53 pm

Having been in the market to buy recently, I was turned off by the nonsense comments in many carsales adds. For example, from a presently listed 1992 w201

"This Mercedes-Benz 190E (No Badge) Sedan has a powerful 1.8 litre engine. You won't find a car like this anywhere else. This car is priced to sell quickly at $9,500. This car has 5 seats, enough for the whole family. "

What is a " no badge" model? No it doesn't have a powerful motor - particularly if it is a 1.8. You will find a car like it elsewhere if you look long enough - and probably better and cheaper at that. It won't sell quickly at $9500; it will be lucky to fetch half that. Most cars have 5 seats, and what if there is six people in your family?!!! And a w201 is hardly a "family" car. All of this is just meaningless twaddle .. and these phrases are repeated in many adds - sometimes the same silly info given 3 or 4 times. Is there some sort of template that suggests them when you make up an add? There is even a 300CE advertised on carsales at moment as having "5 seats, enough for the whole family." CE's only have 4! At least the add I quoted doesn't use another common phrase: "comes with an official roadworthy." One would hope so; an unofficial one is not much use - and if I'm told it has a " full roadworthy" am I meant to be pleased it's not just a partial one?

If selling a car, use natural language and tell us what we need to know - ownership history, log books, recent work done and an honest list of its shortcomings if any. Then a prospective purchaser might actually contact you.
Last edited by gjlockyer on Thu 15 Oct, 2015 5:39 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The how much is my car worth thread

Post by Beamer » Mon 12 Oct, 2015 9:34 pm

gjlockyer wrote:Is there some sort of template that suggests them when you make up an add?
That would be Carsales’ “let us write your ad for you automatically if you can’t spell” feature.

We should at least be thankful they have avoided all references to “immaculate” (and the other 6 possible spellings) (a word that has lost all meaning in car ads over the past few years), “my pride and joy” (that would be why you’re selling it?), “genuine reason for sale” (as opposed to all the possible non-genuine reasons…), “A/C need re-gassing” (immediately following its complete replacement) and “would be cheap to fix” (which is why you should do it after the sale instead of me before the sale).
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Re: The how much is my car worth thread

Post by Brrariror » Thu 08 Jun, 2017 5:59 pm

With a digital point and shoot you can set it right down to take images for web size.

แทงบอล

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Ivanerrol
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Re: The how much is my car worth thread

Post by Ivanerrol » Thu 08 Jun, 2017 9:09 pm

Brrariror wrote:With a digital point and shoot you can set it right down to take images for web size.

แทงบอล

Since I wrote that diatribe back in 2013 :wave: , Things in the imaging department have progressed a little.

Point and shoots have just about gone the way of the film camera (anybody want an F90x?).

iPhone and Samsung phones imaging systems have progressed massively.
Easy to edit and resize images within the phone itself. Not to mention huge improvements in the imaging quality.

The main issue with phone camera is getting sharp images that will blow up to large screen scale. This is an acquired skill. There are google instructions out there.
Another latent issue with camera phones is fill flash. They're not quite there yet. My little beat up 2004 Nikon 7900 nails fill flash every time (better than the D7000).

When selling a product online the hardest part is getting the punter to actually make the effort to come and see what you are selling.
Once you a potential buyer in your space then it's up to you to close a deal. Just make sure you get them there.


Case in point.
I just sold my house - used an online estate agent (the one you see advertised on TV).
The local agent came along sussed the house and suggested two things
(a) get a house styling professional to suggest how to present the house for sale
(b) get really top class images for the online advert. (extra $$$$$)

I followed both of these advice points and ended up getting 10% over the expected optimistic sale price.

The images the professional photographer made were knockout. Even the agent was impressed. I have no doubt whatsoever that the images bought more potential buyers through the door. There were 13 registered bidders at the auction - although the opening bid blew 11 of these out the door.
W211 - E240
W204 - C280
W210 - E240
Departed
W202 - C200, C180, C180
W126 - 380SE , 380SE (Ex SA Import), 560SEL
W124 - 300e, 260e (ex Japan)
W111 220s (Indonesia) 4 speed manual column shift
W123 230
W116 450SEL
W140 420SEL
W210 E240
W209 CLK 240
W201 190e 2.6 (ex U.K.)

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Re: The how much is my car worth thread

Post by 260e3 » Wed 10 Jan, 2018 12:20 am

forgive my ignorance if i cant find this elsewhere.
i have a W124 230TE on offer and i am keen to get some kind of market value range for these. no idea what to pay for it and the owner is also a bit unsure.
it is unregistered, a bit rough - 420,000k on it. but i cant find a w124 wagon for sale anywhere in Australia and also cant find any redbook values.

thanks

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Re: The how much is my car worth thread

Post by Tony From West Oz » Wed 10 Jan, 2018 2:53 am

The following is my opinion only:

It only has value to the one person who wants it.
That price will be low because:
- 420KKm on the clock.
- Unlicenced.
- rough condition.
- 2.3Litre motor.
Ring a wrecker and they will not want it because it is (most likely) 30 years old and they will not get the turnover of parts for a car that old.

The seller would be lucky to get $500 from a committed buyer.
Life is a journey, with problems to solve, lessons to learn, but most of all, experiences to enjoy.

'83 W123 300D 325000km (Wife's car Josephine - sold).
'84 W123 300D replaced good OM617 912 with OM617 952 and enjoyed having good acceleration for the first time since first driving a 300D in 2002 - became engine and trans donor for 300CD Turbodiesel conversion. Now parted out.
'86 W124 300D sold (Wife's old car - sold )
'85 W123 300CD, 275 000km (Fatmobile) rebuilt turbodiesel from previous Fatmobile transplanted into 280CE (occasional tourer)
'99 W202 C250 Turbodiesel (my darling Wife's car - Sold)
'98 W202 C250 Turbodiesel (my car - Sold)
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Re: The how much is my car worth thread

Post by T-Modell » Wed 10 Jan, 2018 4:25 am

Hi,
420.000 on a 230E ... first motor? Leave it ... :whistle:

Regards
Thomas
---------------------------------------------------------------
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Re: The how much is my car worth thread

Post by CraigB » Wed 10 Jan, 2018 10:07 am

Its a reasonable question, because as you say, ones for sale are pretty thin on the ground. If you put yourself in the sellers shoes then this may mean there are people looking for one if he advertised it and if it is a runner and he put it on say gumtree, I reckon he would get more than $500. Go to the other end of the scale, recently there was a very nice looking 300te in perth and it sold very quickly with an asking price of about $8k from memory, but it sounded like a nothing to do car and it would likely cost a lot more than $8k to get this car to that sort of condition. In all honesty, if it has no clear problems apart from the normal wear on a high mileage car, I would probably advertise it for maybe $2k and see what happens. I know Tony wouldn't buy it and i probably wouldn't buy it either, but then i only need to sell it to one person. Depending on how those high miles were put on it, how much work has been done in the past, it is possible it could keep going. I just think there is a minimum price point for perfectly running cars even if a bit rough, that someone will pay. If i wanted to drive it and keep it longish term, i would be looking for that $8k 'bargain' that i potentially have to spend basically nothing on and when i go to sell again it is going to be a hard to find looked after car. But if i just wanted to try one out for a while and wanted to pay less than an electricity bill for something that was local and just there.... maybe, but i would still get it checked out by someone that knows them.

Anyway, that's just a different opinion. Depends on how much you want it and how much the guy wants to get rid of it. If you really don't care you can justify a $500 offer for all the risks of major stuff that goes wrong and not worth fixing and scrap value of say $200. If the guy is offended because he thinks his 'rare' Benz is worth a fortune, then you just walk away. If you want the car and you offered me $500 with the only evidence being an opinion from an internet forum, I would decline and figure it is worth dealing with a few tyre kickers via gumtree. And if i feel i am 'low-balled' on a first offer, I usually have cut it off at that point and respectfully say i need to hold out and spend my time with someone who wants it a bit more than you but i respect the offer - from years of experience i have wasted a lot of time with that buyer who just has to get grind you down - there's always another!

But also, from the other 2 comments, don't underestimate how much can be spent on these cars and consider that often the only logical outcome for cars like this is to sell a few parts off them and take the rest to the crusher or buy another one and combine parts - although that relies on a certain mechanical skill level.
Craig Baulderstone
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Re: The how much is my car worth thread

Post by 260e3 » Wed 10 Jan, 2018 5:50 pm

Thanks guys. i guessed it woudl not be much.
i am really interested as there just doenst seem to many w124 wagons on the market. i would be willing to put some time into it.
i suppose a better question should have been
what would a really top shelf 230TE be worth - if you did it up for instance..

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Re: The how much is my car worth thread

Post by Ivanerrol » Wed 10 Jan, 2018 9:55 pm

Commercially - any vehicle with more than 300,000K's on the clock is worth zero.

You are into the area of enthusiasts only post 300,000K's.
420,000K's - real hardcore enthusiasts.

If you're prepared to wait a better car will eventually come up. That is if you do your homework on the car and let an expert look at any potential purchase from turning into the proverbial money pit.

There are no low K engines left. There are no lowish K transmissions left. The only avenue is rebuilding either of these. - $$$$
W211 - E240
W204 - C280
W210 - E240
Departed
W202 - C200, C180, C180
W126 - 380SE , 380SE (Ex SA Import), 560SEL
W124 - 300e, 260e (ex Japan)
W111 220s (Indonesia) 4 speed manual column shift
W123 230
W116 450SEL
W140 420SEL
W210 E240
W209 CLK 240
W201 190e 2.6 (ex U.K.)

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Re: The how much is my car worth thread

Post by CraigB » Wed 10 Jan, 2018 10:21 pm

300TE I think is seen as a more desirable option and if a top one is $8k then i guess the top 230 is no more than that. But if the basis of the question is that you can get this car at 500 or pay you 500 to take it away, and then make it into a "really top shelf" car, then I don't think it can happen - just the trim alone new or good used I don't think is going to be available. Engine, trans, other mechanical will be $10k without blinking and to get a car with such high mileage to be "top shelf" it would have to be done. But as a much lower shelf example, there are plenty of cars that keep plugging away with repairs and used parts and the owners love them - kind of a badge of honour for just how many miles can be squeezed out of them. They might not be available today and their has never been that many for sale, but there will be more.

I hope that answered the question you were asking.
Craig Baulderstone
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280s's
280SE3.5
280SL
350SL
500SEC's
560SEL's

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Re: The how much is my car worth thread

Post by Beamer » Wed 10 Jan, 2018 10:58 pm

There was a red W124 230TE advertised on Gumtree last year in Adelaide. From memory, it was a bit rough but in reasonable shape with about 2xx,xxx kms on it. Who knows of course whether it actually sold or what for, but my recollection is the seller was asking about $2K and I think the ad stayed up for about 6 months.
Chris
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Joined: Fri 30 Dec, 2016 12:45 pm
Model you own: w124

Re: The how much is my car worth thread

Post by 260e3 » Wed 10 Jan, 2018 11:56 pm

thanks - i think i have a good idea now. my plan was to put my spare 3l and tranny in it and go from there. i guess if there were more on the market i wouldn't think twice about buying this one. all good. thanks

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